Get Out Of Their Way with Coach Karl Hedley

Today's Play: Coach Karl Hedley emphasizes the importance of allowing players to face adversity and develop resilience. Hedley stresses the value of sports in teaching teamwork, respect, and leadership, and advises parents to support their children's growth by stepping back and letting them learn from experiences.

Today's Coach:  Karl Hedley is the Boys Soccer Director at Gwinnett Soccer Association. He's coached youth soccer for 20 years and specializes in coaching middle-school-aged players. 

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Picking Teams: A Playbook for Parents is produced by: Amy Bryant and Sasha Melamud

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Transcript

Amy Bryant: 0:03

Hi parents, and welcome to picking teams the playbook for parents. Today, we're back with Carl Headley, Academy director at Gwinnett Soccer Association. So Carl, how long have you been coaching?

Karl Hedley: 0:17

I've been coaching for just over 17 years now, collectively, it doesn't count the little bit I did when again at Coastal, when they have camps. I work camps kind of got me into it originally. And when I went back to England, did a little bit, but very, very little. It wasn't till I came back as actually, when my oldest daughter started playing, when she was nine, eight or nine. I think the frustrations of watching the rec coach drove me crazy, so I just, I was watching her, like, sit back on the top of her 18 yard box, and I'm sitting there trying not to say anything, because I know it's right until the very final game where I spoke up and said, Get out. Get up, step up. And a few of the parents turn went, could you coach him next year? So that's kind of that started. That was back when the cure soccer club was around. So that was because, you know, I don't know whether you know the story, but the merge, but yeah, say were two separate things. That was about 1718, years ago. Okay, so I've been at GSA since then. So whatever, to cure into GSA couple of years in the rec program, and then pied on to be an academy coaching and not soon after, the academy director. I was the Girls Academy director for a while, believe it or not, which I don't know whether I meshed well with girls, but a few years later, became the boys Academy director.

Amy Bryant: 1:40

And you played professionally, too, right?

Karl Hedley: 1:43

So I played in England, in the local non lower leagues, non leagues in the Liverpool area. Originally came back, came to the States in, I think it was 88 in the middle beach area, like I told you a story, with the intention of going to coastal I headed back to England in 1990 the disillusioned idea of becoming Pro, and then played in the lower league, semi pro before COVID. They had a little bit of a back injury. And honestly, it was getting to the point that the lower leagues in England, like every game, was a fight, and I mean a physical fight. And I just wasn't that type of player. I was one of the ball on the ground. Wanted to knock it around, and every time back then it was lump it forward, kick it as far as you can. And then every opportunity they had, it was a there was a scrap, like a physical fight. And I was just, I got fed up with it. So between back injury and and all that. I just stopped playing for many, many years, probably six or seven years, and nothing to do with the game. But again, you're talking about like being in an environment where I was going to amfields with Liverpool regularly, just immersed in the game. You know, which most kids growing up in England are, that's it's everything you know. So people say, you know, when they when they were kids, they wanted to be doctors, lawyers or football players. There was most of the kids, me included, that I knew only wanted to be soccer players. We didn't. There was nothing else we didn't know. I mean, my favorite player that lived just up the road for me, I knew his license plate number by heart like it was. My passion was to be him, and that's all I wanted to do. I didn't know. But again, the downside is, what happens with school, right? That was the crappy part of it all, is that school got left as a secondary, whereas I could have been doing more and getting a better education and so on and so forth. So by the way, I've been with the thirteens, twelves, thirteens, fourteens, in sort of that age group, but I've been doing those in that age group since the 2000 and fives. Were you 13, seven years, seven, eight years of probably eight years of being in the youth 13 age group.

Amy Bryant: 3:52

What was it that made you switch to the you 13 age group, or the 12, 1314,

Karl Hedley: 3:58

it was actually the it was the merger, I think because I was doing kind of thing, if I was doing the I was doing the I was the Girls Academy director at tequila, and the girls that I'd had, I had an older team. So I'd like the two the 90 sevens, I think it was, and then the 2000 and twos were the younger team, and we've done quite well. The 2012 2000 and twos have done quite well. We'd actually beat GSA at stake cup, who were ranked number one. It was Judson's team. Judson and Campbell were there trying to whatever, when state cup beat them in state cup, and then it was, I think it was just a topic of conversation, like, who's going to take the boys when they merge? And knowing Nuno from when I was younger. I think he put a, you know, an influenced word in and said, I want Carl to take the team. So that was actually the first year of boys ECM. So the U 13 is 2005 with the first year of Boise. And I, okay, you know. So, yeah, I'm just a big fan of always doing the same ages, just because I think you start to know the kids, you know, I know that they can't make an early training session because of bus getting in and off the, you know, for middle school. And I've got an idea when testing is and you start to understand the moods and the buttons are kids that you can push. And you know, I'm your son's a prime example. I could push his button all the way right, but then the kids sitting next to him, you couldn't necessarily say the same things. And I think that goes all the way through adulthood, but I think the temperament at a younger age is more important, because you you lose a kid quickly, if you're you're offensive to him, or you're pointing out at the wrong time and embarrass him, or whatever. Kids exactly like miles, you can do that with, but other kids you have to kind of so I'm a big fan. In my academy set up the same way. Is every year, the lead coach remains the lead coach. Staff. Coaches may move in between up and down, but the lead coach gets to have an idea and philosophy of what those ages need and what they don't need, what works, what doesn't work. And by the way, it's easier for coaching because I have a curriculum that I just keep repeating, yeah, speaking when it when it works and when it doesn't work. So I think session plan tonight, look at the day what we're working on. Hit print it. And, you know, I've done it 100 times, so it helps. But yeah, that was, that was the start of the boys, you it was also, by the way, the same year Alani and I had started. Okay, so it was the getting used to, how do you deal with I've got 14, 1516, players, top players going into you 13, because we did a like a preseason combined session. But three or four of these might go. And that year, a lot went because they didn't have an academy. There wasn't any so, you know, it was the 2000 fives were. We had four went. 2006 is two went at the time. So it was, it was a lot to deal with, because we never had to deal with that before. It never and since then, I've seen a massive change in the boy side, by the way, which is a good topic of conversation, because I think it's a it's a completely different setup and entity than it used to be. It used to be exactly the same as the girls side. In fact, the girls side was probably more important because girls football, or girls soccer in the States, was more popular since at it's changed completely. I mean, it's massively changed. I think the boy side is more popular now. The pro games change things dramatically. Kids want to go to bars or Academy, wanting to go to Spain. Want to, you know, and it's just, I talk to Drew at the club all the time. I'm like, we've got to figure out how, maybe we need to run this boy side just a little bit different, because these kids up until the age of, I mean, you probably well, you will know way more than me. Up until the age of about 16, maybe even 17, they couldn't care less about going to college. They couldn't care less, and then they hit 17 and go, Oh, crap, you know, I'm not going to make a pro. I'm going to need to go to college. And by the way, the odds are dramatically reduced, right? Like these odds now of kids going with these MLS Academy, kids coming over and foreign students, still they're in the one and 2% that go play correct, double EIGHT small numbers. You know what? They don't realize that the pro numbers are even smaller. It's definitely the mindset has changed on the boys side, and I think it's completely separate now from the girls on the way, where we run things. So that's been a massive change since the Oh fives to now, when I'm dealing with these parents of these youth, 13 people who are just like every single one of them, want to go to Portugal, want to go to Spain, want to go to Boston Academy. Or they just think if Atlanta and I had not spotted them, it's Atlanta United fault or our fault, and they need to go somewhere else and find it completely disillusioned. Yeah, well,

Amy Bryant: 9:13

that's, I mean, that's the thing like. And this is what I always say, is like. And I'll give you a personal story about miles. You know, you mentioned him earlier, so Miles was struggling at the beginning of this year, and he for the listeners that don't know, my ninth grader is at Atlanta united, and he sustained an injury during, gosh, his first year there, that caused him to Miss about five months of the season, and came back. He worked really hard this summer to come back, came back in the fall, and wasn't getting any playing time. You know, these kids, mine, included, are used to that instant gratification of, you know, you do this, you get that, and it happens just like that. They're not used to having to really work for something and the time that it takes to actually achieve the goals that you've set for yourself. So in any case, he had this conversation with me. He said, You know, if, if I'm not playing, then, then I think I should just look to go somewhere else, like, let's just go to St Louis and play for Kansas City. Because that Coach talked to him when he was at ODP, when he was like, 11, right? He thinks that's still an option that's on the table. And he also thinks that, as his parent, that I would, I would drop everything to move across the country, right? And he got the cold, stark reality conversation from me, which was, if you can't make it here at the program that's down the street, then we're not going anywhere else. It's not Atlanta United's fault that you're not starting this is, you know, and it's not your fault either, in a lot of ways, I mean, and you can't help an injury, but after an injury, it takes work to get back, and that's what you have to embrace, is that work, and if you can get there, great. And the happy end of the story, I will say he is getting back and getting his playing time now, and he's certainly not singing that same tune.

Karl Hedley: 11:15

Personally what I think you've done there is what I my biggest critical point towards parents is, is you've allowed adversity and asked them to deal with it, right? Which is what most parents don't do. It's you've got a problem. You've got an issue. Let me fix it for you. That's right, if you, if you look at most top pros, and I haven't gone and pulled most top pros, but in general, and you can even look at the very top. You can look at the Messies and the ronaldos of the world. There's a adversity backstory in there somewhere for those people who remember David Beckham released because he was too small. The amount of times that happens with players, messy couldn't grow, poverty area, all those types of things. I had a friend of mine who ended up playing in in the Premier League for Aston Miller years ago, and was in the street, average, above average, strong, fairly tall, quick, fairly quick, a little bit quick. But his adversity was he had a bad home life, like he just wanted to get out of his house. So he had that adversity, and his parents were never going to help him deal with that, because dad was a drunk and all whatever, all these things beat him. The adversity was to the goal was to get out of that house and do something with his life. And he had no other skill and trade, so he literally worked and found himself in the Premier League at 28 what was to drive within. Was to get out of where he was, a situation where he was, I'm not saying for one minute, the parents should create that kind of home life for adversity. But there's so much out there. Let them get put on a second team. Let them not start. Let them not have great minutes. Ask them, go ask the coach what they can do to get more minutes. It's not simple. Parents don't need to go and ask the coach. Absolutely. It's constant with the questions and the wanting to understand why their players not playing. And the worst one is you always play your favorites. It's my favorite one of all time. That isn't it funny how my favorites are the better players. Better players. Let the other ones work to achieve what those players have got, right and whatever it is. And by the way, if you don't like the coach, there's going to be another one right around the corner, so you can go and impress the next guy, but you've got to learn to deal with you go sign it, and again, you'll know way more about the college scene than I do. You go sign a four year deal at a college and you go off, and then within a week of being there, the college coach gets fired, and you've got a brand new guy, and he doesn't like you, or you get a roommate that doesn't like you. Parents can't swoop in and deal with these things. They got to deal with it on their own, and they've got to learn to get over it and get over the adversity. Unless they're in danger, let them get on with it, because there's going to be issues, and they're going to have problems, and they're going to have problems they need to solve, on and off the pitch, by the way, you know for me, but you look at, you look at the the conversation you've had with Miles, where are we moving to to do what? What is it we're trying to accomplish? Just to say we played at a pro Academy, because that tends to it all of a sudden. It tends to identify you as who you are. You are Jim that plays for Atlanta united. You leave Atlanta united, and now you're just Jim. How do you how do you change your life to suit who you really are, because that's your identity. I grew up with so many kids that I knew that you're the kid who goes to back then the academies were different center or center of excellence, but you were the kid that went to Liverpool, you were the kid that went to Everton, and then all of a sudden you weren't, and nobody really knows who the kid is anymore, because he never had any sort of life around that you go to St Louis to the end result to be less than 1% of the Academy kids to have a chance to make a living playing the game. By the way that started, England is point 01 2% to make a living. And making a living is earning a few 100 pound a week in the lower leagues, or just getting bus fare or whatever. That's such a small number. And you're talking about in a country with hundreds of pro clubs here, we've got, I mean, how many times you're going to make a living? And by the way, when they get into like MLS, what are they on now, 60 grand? Yeah, very much. These days, you can't live on that, what do we find? What are we moving for? What are we trying to accomplish? You've got the best opportunity right here in your best and your doorstep. You've got a pro club here that, by the way, will spot you, as we tell kids at our club all the time the amount of players that we send after you, 13, after you, 14, after you 15. And by the way, those are the ones that normally end up staying. They're not the ones that went in at 11 and 12. It's the ones that went in at 1516, they stay, they get off to a d1 college, or in the case of one or two, they get their opportunity to play in the first team or be around the first team, but it's so few and far between. We just got to step back and take, take a dose of reality and go. It's your dream, and you don't need to break it, but it's there has to be something else that has to be,

Amy Bryant: 16:31

yeah, so what would you say? What's the message here to our families, like, what should that other thing be? Why should their kids be playing sport? What's it really all about

Karl Hedley: 16:40

it to me. I mean, you've got loads of values that come from playing sport, right, the teamwork and the camaraderie and the respect and all these different things. And that's all always for me, is, you know, is about, as a coach, the first thing I want to do is try and develop the player first, right? For the for the reasons we just gave less than a percent is going to go pro and make a living play like they're going to be doctors and lawyers and brick players and painters and all that. Be respectful people when you do that. If we can teach that through sport, any sport, it's got a massive But to me, what we just talked about, the first thing parents need to do is get out of their way. Just get out of their way and let them develop to become young men young women. Let them step into their life as it's going to become. You can guide them and be advice for them when they get home or the rest of it needs to be. What did, what did the coach ask it? What did he? Did he ask you something during this session? What did you talk about during the session? Because I've got parents that you've seen them fence huggers, as we call them. They're right up against the fence. They're looking at your every move. And if that kid comes off sweating and drowning in sweat and exhausted and go straight home, they think that is success, and that's what success looks like. But ask them, What did you learn? What did you talk about? What points did you get from the session that's got way more value, and sometimes it can be just, I learned to, you know, encourage my teammates. I learned to talk to my teammates alone, to be positive. I just mentioned. I love the age groups, 12 and 13, but there's such a negative everything's like, Oh no, you know, they have that long whiny syllables at the end, like, what are you doing forever? I know you've heard it from boys. It drives you nuts. And my goal, a lot of times in a session, is just to change that. You know, you can be a leader. You're right. Your words are right. What you're saying is, yeah, what he just did was crap, but there's a way to tell him it was crap, because you've got to have the players drive in the session right at the end of the day. I can help him and guide him into him, but when they step over the white line on a Saturday, they've got to drive each other. They've got to tell each other they can do better or work harder, or that pass wasn't good enough for your level, or whatever it is, but the whining thing, just so even if it's something like that in a session that I learned today to encourage my teammates or talk to my right back and make him talk in a little bit more, or get him to get him to step up a little bit, I think those things have more value than anything. Parents don't need to say, I watched you tonight, and you didn't do this, this and this, if you watched and they didn't work hard enough, they were misbehaving and they weren't watching them, they weren't paying attention. That's that's a parent conversation, to me. The rest of it is, let them get in there, get out of the way. Let them make the mistakes. And at the end of it, you get what you get. These kids are going to make it in spite of you and me, or they're not going to make it in spite of you and me, that's the bottom line for me, right?

Amy Bryant: 19:49

Yeah, it's a great message. I love that. It's a great way to end. So thanks so much for being here. Carl, it was great to have you, and you shared so many excellent insights. I appreciate it. Thank you. Appreciate it. Thanks so much for listening today. If you're looking for more practical advice for parenting your athlete, check out my new ebook. Let them play a no nonsense guide for parents. It's available on Amazon for Kindle and on our website, links in the show Notes.